Interview with Dr. Pavel Tulaev by Evangelos Kioussis, the editor of the web magazine “Ideon Antron” (Greece).
Mr. Tulaev, thank you very much for your time that you provide us to make this interview happen. I would like to begin this conversation if this suits you as well, by asking you to give us a brief biography of yours, with your own words.
Thank you for your interest, Mr. Evangelos Kioussis. I am glad to receive your invitation and to give an interview for the web-magazine «Ideon Antron». I like the way you are publishing materials and the content itself. Your Antron reminds me of a legend about the CAVE OF THE NYMPHS, referred to by Homer and commented symbolically by Porphyry, as well as other sacred temples of the pre-Christian era.
It’s not easy to give my biography in full for this publication, or even a brief one. But if you want me to represent myself in short, I can say the following.
My name is Pavel. Tulaev is the surname of our family. In Russian I am called Pavel Vladimirovich after the name of my father Vladimir Tulaev. He had been an officer of the intelligence service. I was born in 1959, in Krasnodar, that is situated in Southern Russia, not far from the Black Sea. Since 1971 our family has lived in Moscow, where I was educated in secondary school, in the Institute of Foreign Languages, and in graduate studies.
I had started to read books at 5 years old with the help of my parents. The first classical story I had heard was “Odysseia”. Later, when I was a student and a young poet, the Hellenic culture had strongly influenced my mind. I was enjoying ancient mythology and orphic hymnography.
Plato and Aleksej Lossev (a great Russian neoplatonic) are my favorite philosophers. I have seriously studied their works, so the dialectics have become one my methods of thinking. The first intellectual group I had organized in 1988 was named “Prometheus” and that was understood in theurgical terms, not political.
Now I have a Ph.D. in History, am a scholar and a writer, the head of the Russian ATHENAEUM and it’s art-director. See the web-page: www.ateney.ru When publishing the magazine NASLEDIJE PREDKOV (The Heritage of Ancestors) I was elected vice-president of Moscow department of “Synergy European”. Then I had become one of the leaders of the Russian New Right and Slavonic movement.
From my childhood I have lived and worked in many countries: from Austria and Australia to Spain and the USA. As a journalist and a researcher I have traveled a lot around Russia and Europe.
I am the author of many publications in different genres: “K Ponimaniyu Russkogo” (Understanding Russia, 1994), “Veneti: predki slovjan” (Veneti: Ancestors of Slavs, 2000), «Athena and Athenaeums» (2007), «Russkij concert Poletajeva» (Talking about the Music, 2007), “Rodnyje bogui” (Native Gods, 2008), “Istoki rodnogo mira” (The Native World’s Roots, 2011); “Russia and Spain: The Two European Wings” (getting ready to be published) etc.
Besides that I have published some important collections: “Rossija i Evropa: opit sobornogo analisa” (Russia and Europe: The Experience of Sobor Analysis, 1992), “Russkaya Perspectiva” (Russian Perspective, 1996), “Varvary” (Barbarians, 1999) and many authors’ works, including Andreas Gottliebe Mash, Yuri Venelin, Jose Antonio Primo de Rivera, Francisco Franco, Dmitry Dudko, Antony Sutton, and Guillaume Faye.
Some of my works have been translated into foreign languages. They are collected with my interviews in the book “THE WHITE WORLD IN MY HEART” (Moscow, 2011). When I say “White” (“Belyj” in Russian) I consider not only anthropology but mostly ontological and symbolical sides of the being. White is Light and Spirit first of all.
For my publications, social and art activities, I was awarded with medals and the Order of Beauty.
If you need more information about me, you are welcome to visit my personal web-page www.tulaev.ru with texts in 10 languages and my video interviews.
Would you like to tell us also some things about the Athenaum magazine project and its history up to date?
Yes, of course. My ATHENAEUM was founded in 2000 as a Russian international edition. It inherited the tradition of worshiping Athena, the ancient goddess of Wisdom and just Warfare. As you know in world history there were several Athenaeums, sprung as centers of science, art and enlightenment. In my country there were three magazines published under the Russian name АТЕНЕЙ in the XIX and in the beginning of the XX centuries. We wanted to continue this classical heritage. Basing ourselves upon our predecessors’ experience and studying their works, we have focused on the up-to-date tasks of major importance.
Tackling the problems of the contemporary world, we touched upon a wide range of topics on history and religion, race and aesthetics, science and technology, economics and politics, conspiracy and war theories, personal and international relations. In our АТЕНЕЙ, one can find materials of various genres: academic articles, literary essays, analytical forecasts, strategic research, new book and CD reviews.
From the ideological point of view, АТЕНЕЙ is not a nationalist magazine. It is a pan-European, pan-Aryan and pan-Slavonic review with White ideals in the Russian language.
During the first decade of the new millennium we have published ten issues of the paper almanac and some important books on history and raciology. In a short period of time from 2000 to 2010 АТЕНЕЙ had become a think tank of the Russian New Right, uniting readers and friends from many countries.
For understandable reasons we have also obtained political opponents. They didn’t like our critics of the aggressive US and Israel politics and started to attack our positions. After this provocation the authorities of the Russian Federation had decided to check АТЕНЕЙ for «extremist» statements. Indeed it was a question of unreasonable charges in connection with a new ideological campaign.
The authors of the magazine had to defend their constitutional rights for free thought and speech. Because nobody can make scientific researches and realize publishing activities without freedom. We did our best, spent a lot of time and money for proving our legal position. In spite of this the judicial system forced me as the editor-in-chief to close the paper magazine. Now we have only the electronic edition, but in fact this is a different one.
There is without doubt a total change in all perspectives on European soils. The form of States evolving into something uncertain; probably the people in Europe faces as Mr. Faye predicted the century of Europe’s fate. How do you see all these changes, and what role Russia seems that will play in the nearest future?
You are absolutely right! Not only Europe, but the whole world has entered into a new epoch. XXI century technologies and transnational business strategies make us live in a new time and space. Christian fatalists are proclaiming The End of the World, the Apocalypse. Other people call it New Age, post-Christian or post-Communist era. Some positive thinkers dream about New Renaissance or Krita Yuga.
Mr. Guillaume Faye, who is my friend, is criticizing the European Union politics for its economic opportunism and cosmopolitism. The EU is supporting the NATO’s western strategies that are in fact anti-European. Traditional Europe is not the West. May be the great Hellenic culture used to be Western?
After visiting Moscow a few times Guillaume Faye has realized that Russia is the Historical axe of the European Fate. Located in the center of the Eurasian Continent (Материк), Russia has become the biggest European country, protecting Christian civilization from Mongol-Tatars and Turkish nomads. Thanks to its European culture and strategy Russia is the Heart of the Continent now.
NATO’s anti-Russian geopolitics is not effective in protecting European interests. NATO’s anti-Islam aggression is only a pretext for liberal capitalists invading our countries. Does USA defend modern Greece from Turkish expansion? Why do they support Albanian Muslims, who are not Europeans by original?
Modern Europe obviously needs a post-NATO alternative, a new military and political block. That’s why the President of Russia has stated in his programmatic NEW INTEGRATION PROJECT (2011):
“The Eurasian Union will be based on universal integration principles as an essential part of Greater Europe united by shared values of freedom, democracy, and market laws.
Russia and the EU agreed to form a common economic space and coordinate economic regulations without the establishment of supranational structures back in 2003. In line with this idea, we proposed setting up a harmonised community of economies stretching from Lisbon to Vladivostok, a free trade zone and even employing more sophisticated integration patterns. We also proposed pursuing coordinated policies in industry, technology, the energy sector, education, science, and also to eventually scrap visas. These proposals have not been left hanging in midair; our European colleagues are discussing them in detail”.
There is a significant rise of forms only- by my opinion- of Right wing movements all across Europe. On the other hand, Left seems unable, or in any case tired to raise a voice against the attack of the Capital. Do you think that these ideological grounds have “depth” in Europe, are there strong enough to move people’s reactions, or do we need a new Political Model such as “Archaeofuturism” for example or any other worthy by your opinion?
This global historical turn to the Right has become obvious after the fall of the USSR. But the rise of the New Right had started before. Formally it was the reaction to the New Left revolution in 1968 and more profoundly it reflected European opposition to the USA-USSR postwar architecture. When the Soviet communist system crashed in 1991 many rightists went on with their anti-Americanism. Jean-Francois Thiriart, Alain de Benoist, Pierre Vial, Guillaume Faye, Robert Steuckers and many other European intellectuals have become leaders of this movement. In the economic program the New Right is not capitalist. They support the idea of the “Third Way”, that means cooperation of the national state and private business. It is close to the doctrine of National Socialism.
At the same time the leftists have become the base of the Movement against Globalization. They are tolerant in many aspects, but strongly anti-imperialist. The New Right leaders understand this social radicalism, but cannot admit leftist political, cultural, racial and sexual chaos. That’s why the ideology of “Archaeofuturism”, that you have mentioned, is different from the New Left program, from modern anarchist and communist theories. Archaeofuturism is based on European roots and traditional culture, racial and genetic heritage, social hierarchy and advanced technologies.
Please let us stand for a while in multicultural societies that are taking form every day more and more in Europe. Without having any intention of “conspirology”, is by your opinion only a matter of world’s economy that brings all these people of a total different culture in Europe? Is there a plan for all this, and if yes why and by whom?
Modern multicultural societies in Europe are the result of some historical tendencies. First it is the backside of White colonization. When Africa, Asia and Latin America proclaimed their political and economical independence, the so called “Third World” had started its own colonization of Europe. It was not so clear in the beginning of the process, but now it is evident for everybody. Naturally every people has the right to its identity. But it is really difficult to coexist for many ethnic groups in one place.
For economic reasons migrants give benefit to private companies. In modern Russia, for example, some new capitalists prefer to exploit Chinese workers and not local citizens, because they pay them less and don’t have to carry out social security programs. After, most of the migrants stay in Russia and make their own careers.
To your question about the global plan, I will answer – yes, it exists. The World Government is working in the forms of elite clubs and international organizations, like the Bilderberg Group or Trilateral Commision. The New World Order is a plan, isn’t it? But, I am not sure that global strategists are able to control all economic and political processes, the world migrations included. They would like to do it. They try to do it.
Do you find possible to take place another Great War for Cultural reasons?
To my opinion the new Great War is in full swing, not only for Cultural reasons. It had started after the terrorist diversion of the 11th of September 2001 in New York City. This is a new type of war, a global conflict of the modern generation. Its subjects are transnational structures, like bankers, web-companies or the pornography business. This war is waged by qualitatively new weapons: brainpower, high technologies, biopolitics, mass media and drugs. It is like the golden cage or «honey hell». That’s why I call it the “Sweet War”. The opposite side of the front just pay, buy and applaud. You pay the game that is killing you.
What should we do in this dramatic situation?
We must work and fight together for a Traditionalist and New Right alternative to the modern degeneration. We should carefully study Ancient, Vedic and Christian traditions. We will go on organizing feasts and congresses, publishing books, magazines, newspapers, constructing our Web-sites and exchanging information.
We dream about Aryan Revolution, based on the positive terms and aspects of the movement. We must not repeat the mistakes of the 20th century. We should be more wise, educated and strong, because we are responsible for our nations, our race and common heritage.
If you would like know to talk about Religion. What thoughts comes in your mind when reading this quote: “By religion, then, I understand a propitiation or conciliation of powers superior to man which are believed to direct and control the course of nature and of human life” (James G. Frazer). Do you believe that monotheism and Polytheism are total different point of views of Cosmos and determine modern European reaction on social challenges of the future?
Why not talk about Religion? It is important in many aspects. Sir James George Frazer, whose famous book “The Golden Bough” I had read a long time ago, is reasonable in the quotation that you are giving, but only in part. Any religion is not faith only. It is a system of traditional extra personal notions. Vedic religion, for example, is based on the eternal knowledge that is Veda itself (compared with ancient Athena and Christian Sophia).
Vedic or Arian religions are always polytheistic. Our Native Gods are immanent to the world. They are relatives and formulate various pantheons. We find monotheism in the Semitic, or so-called Abrahamic, religious tradition. In Judaism, for example, the God (Yahweh, Jehovah, Sabbaoth) has created the universe out of complete nothingness. Between the non-created God and the world he created lies an abyss. Yahweh is not only transcendental, he is even hostile to divine reality.
In this connection aggressive monotheism can be dangerous for authentic religions. So the European traditionalists should use Veda (Knowledge) and dialectics as a method against the totalitarian theology.
Back in Russian reality. What are the conditions there? Many have seen a coming back of Traditionalism in the provinces of Russia and in the cities a strong imperialistic movement. Is this by your opinion an exact way to describe things?
No, this is not the exact way to describe Russian life. Both Traditionalism and Imperialistic movement are products of modern cities. The rebirth of the authentic ancient religion is the reaction of the patriotic intelligence to the cosmopolite and internationalist culture. Traditional folklore was dying and degenerating during the XX century. Modern pagans mostly live in the cities and go out to Nature only for feasts and rites. Heathen mysteries are alternative to the postmodern show culture.
Russian Imperialistic movement is based on Orthodox Christianity and historical patriotism. Its idea is to reconstruct the traditional Russian State instead of the modern multicultural Federation. By the way, Orthodox communities are stronger in the provinces than pagan circles.
Can you provide us some more information about Native Faiths and its movement in Russia today? I know that you participated a lot with your work all these years for helping this movement grow there in a healthy way!
Yes, I am one of the leaders of the Native Faith in Russia. My heathen name is Bujan which means a sacred island. However I don’t have a pagan community and do not hold feasts. I am a classical scholar and academic. I live in a home library and spend all my time reading books and writing my works. Ten years ago I used to often participate in pagan rites outside Moscow (Ukraine, Lithuania, Poland). But now I go away with my wife Nadezda mostly for conferences and archeological expeditions (Belorussia, Slovenia, Italia, Bulgaria).
“The Heritage of Ancestors” magazine, that we published in 1995-2000, collaborated with the World Congress of Ethnic Religions (WCER) led by Jonas Trinkunas and Союз Славянских Общин (Union of Slavonic Communities) led by Vadim Kazakov. Our publications were spread among pagans and influenced them. Now they publish their own magazines “The Oaks” in Vilnius (Lithuania) and “Родноверие” (Native Faith) in Kaluga (Russia).
The album “Native Gods” that I did with my ex-wife Galyna Lozko, one of the leaders of the Ukrainian pagans (ridnoviry), was also a big success. It contains 230 reproductions of contemporary Slavic artists’ works, dedicated to the ancient pantheon, and detailed glossary of 94 entries. Together they represent the aesthetic movement for our racial archetype and sacred tradition. From that time I have started to collect my ART-GALLERY and to organize exhibitions in Russia and abroad. Everybody is welcome to see our collection, photo chronicle and videos.
The Council of Slavonic Native Faith (Родовое Славянское Вече), that we had created in 2003, was a very important event. It has many participants and followers. But after the “Orange Revolution” it fell in crises due to national contradictions between Ukrainians and Russians. That’s why Byelorussians, led by Vladimir Satsevich, foundered an alternative organization – Russian Council of Native Faith (Родовое Вече Руси).
Besides, there are many local heathen leaders and communities. The very important one is led by Veleslav (Ilija Cherkasov), a very strong mystic, the head of the circle “Родолюбие” (Rodolubije). Ljubije – means philia. And Rod is Genus and Family in Russian. So Rodolubije is the cult of Ancestors. Veleslav has many heathern publications that unite Vedic, Russian and Slavonic sacred traditions. His community in the Moscow region and neighborhood is the biggest one. When he holds the Kupala feast in the middle of the summer it gathers more than a thousand people.
Last years the Heathen movement is becoming more and more virtual because of internet possibilities. There are very many pagan web-sites and contact groups on FACEBOOK, that even I don’t know.
What is your opinion about the future of Russia in general?
It is not easy to predict the future. The coming reality is always different from what we plan, because there are many invisible and unpredictable things. But let’s try.
Beforehand I would like you to understand that Russia is not a simple country. It is a spiritual continent, a big universe, like Hellenic ?????????. It was called Holy Russia, Moscow Kingdom, Russian Empire, Soviet Union, and now under the name of Russian Federation it is still keeping some special essence. We call it Fate or Destiny.
What you call the ‘Russian people’ is another enigma. Because this collective subject is much more than population. Russians, like Romans, keep the soul of the Imperium. Besides, the Body of our Nation is guarding the memory and the spirit of the White race.
Our enemies would like Russia to be a convenient country of the Thirds World, like Canada or Brazil, but it is impossible for the reasons I have told you. Then the world architects who are behind the backstage had decided to divide Russia into independent states. The result was that our Nation itself was cut into pieces.
So Russian people, unfortunately, have become a divided Nation, like Germans after World War II. The very heart of our Old Russia has been broken into three parts: Great Russia, White Russia (Belarus), and the Ukraine (its historical name was Rus or Little Russia).
It is very difficult now to reunite independent countries into one state. But I think that a free reintegration in the field of economy and culture is possible. Our project of Euro-Russia will help every country of the Continent to find its honorable place.
New Russia should be a strong National state, because our native people compose more than 80% of the whole population. We do not need a multicultural version for our homogeneous nation. Other Slavonic, European and Asian people can be our allies in the world struggle against human degradation.
From the economic point of view, Russian patriots prefer the socialist model with free enterprising or national-capitalism with state protection. Anyway, liberal monetarism is not adopted, because it ruins the industry and the society.
Russia is now living a difficult period of its history, but the bottom of the crises we have passed. What we need is national consolidation on the base of good spirit, family life, health and justice.
Would like to tell us how you see from a Russian point the condition in Hellas? There are many citizens here that feel strongly Russia as a Traditional ally of Hellas.
You tell the truth about the traditions of friendly relations between Hellas and Russia. We never forget that your land is the cradle of the European civilization and the home of the world Olympic movement. For thousand years our countries belong to the Orthodox world with a similar Christian calendar and veneration of saints. The Russian Church has accepted a Liturgy of the Greek rite, written by Saint John Chrysostom. Together with Orthodox Russia we adopted the new writing, called «Cyrillic». It is based on the medieval Byzantine letter, reformed in the light of the Slavic phonetics. Thanks to Byzantine literature the «Hellenic scholarship» came in Eastern Europe. That is why the first academies in Russia were called «Greek-Slavic.» Empress Catherine the Great saw the future of our Empire as the Orthodox Hellenic world, and sought to liberate Constantinople. After the victory of the Holy Alliance over Napoleon’s army, the Greek aristocrat Ioannis Kapodistrias became Minister of Foreign Affairs of the Russian Empire, and prepared the independence of Hellas from Turkey. When in 1821 the Greek patriots rebelled against the Ottoman yoke, Russia supported the revolutionaries, and then in 1827, together with France and England, defeated Port’s navy.
The rise of the Balkan countries, including Greece, led to the First World War and the destruction of European empires. Therefore, in the Soviet era, the relationship between our two nations have evolved under the influence of communist ideology. Now, when Russian people are able to freely travel the world, Greece has become one of the most popular tourist destinations. About one million ‘of’ Russians every year come to your country for the rest and more than 14,000 live there or have some property. So they have voted for Hellas by their «feet.»
Russia and Greece are now closer than ever before, and we hope that this mutual sympathy grows into a strong economic and political union.
Considering the modern situation in Hellas, you know it better, then me. I just follow the news from mass media and read some analytics. Now they are writing about the results of elections in July 2012, political demonstrations and financial crisis. We know, for example, that the external debt of Greece is about $350 billion. To my opinion this is not a feature of your country, but a regularity of the world banking system. Italy, Spain and Portugal are also big debtors. The inner debt of the USA to the banks is $15 trillion! So we understand that radical declarations about the exit of Greece from the EURO zone reflect real intentions of your nationalists. However the returning back to drachma will not be easy and will bring the county to a very difficult economic situation. And if Greece leaves the EU, the consequences could be unpredictable. Anyway, the new credits and money themselves cannot resolve the whole complexity of national problems.
The final words are yours! Please close this interview the way you want and send your message to all Hellenes readers! I really appreciate that you gave me the opportunity to have this interview! You have a public open invitation by me personally and all of us in Thyrsos community and to express your thoughts through our magazine whenever you like!
I receive with pleasure your kind invitation to the Thyrsos community, dear Evangelos Kioussis. Twice I have been to Hellas. Twice I went up to the Sacred Acropolis in Athens and visited Parthenon. I have studied carefully the richest collection of the National Archeological Museum and spent some hours in the National Library of Greece where I left as a gift my album about Native Gods. Then I went to Thessaloniki, where the statue of Alexander the Great is erected, and stayed for some days at the Evvoia (Euboea) Island.
There are some important intellectuals in Hellas that I know personally. In 2003 I took part in the conference of APMA (ΕΘΝΟΚΟΙΝΟΤΙΚΟΣ ΔΕΣΜΟΣ ΕΛΛΗΝΩΝ – ASSOCIATION FOR ETHNIC AND NATIONAL EUROPEAN REBIRTH) in Kallipeukh near the Olympus. Our friendship had started by exchanging magazines, so I could have an idea of what «ХРУSH АУГH» (Golden Dawn), «BOРЕION CEЛAC» (Polar Light), and «АПОЛЛОNEIO ФОС» (Appolo’s Light), is. Then my Greek correspondents Stephanos Gekas and Eleftherios Ballas took part in the Moscow conferences “The White World’s Future” (2006) and “Russia and Europe” (2007), where they represented their program of Arian and Racial Renaissance. At the World Congresses of Ethnic Religions in Lithuania and Italy I met your compatriot Vlasis Rassios, famous for his defense of the authentic Hellenic tradition. And now I am a subscriber and one of the authors of «AB AETERNO» magazine, published by Dr. Dimitris Michalopoulos.
It is a great honour for me to send a message to all readers of «Ideon Antron». I love divine Greece and wise Hellenic culture very much. It is living in my heart from youth and has become already a part of my soul. One of the best parts! My private library has a good collection of ancient classics, albums about Hellenic Art and Mythology, CD’s with music from Greece: from folk songs and dances to Vangelis. I have started with the sacred Orphic poetry and Prometheus society and then came to the Russian Athenaeum. It is obvious that the very mature step is ahead. Now in our Theurgy we’ll be closer to Zeus, who had created Athena from his brain. We will construct new Worlds, new Wisdom and new Heroes. We will conquer our Paradise and will build our own Olympus. In the name and the Glory of Native Gods!
Thank you once again!
P.S. Let me also thank Nikarev Leshy for proofreading and corrections of the English text of my interview.